# A Puzzle For The Forum

**URL:** <https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474>\
**Category:** Conversation\
**Tags:** Science, Art\
**Created:** [November 18, 2020, 5:08pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474 "2020-11-18T17:08:40Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![swamidass](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/swamidass/32/3_2.png) [@swamidass](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/swamidass)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 5:08pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/1 "2020-11-18T17:08:40Z")

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![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/b/bda71e624a4212f0c2c17915051e0197efb3bb75.png)

What is this? Is it ordered? Is it random? Is it beautiful?

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**Author:** ![faded\_Glory](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/faded_glory/32/7167_2.png) [@faded\_Glory](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/faded_Glory)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 5:15pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/2 "2020-11-18T17:15:13Z")

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Entirely depends where you found it.

If it is a time slice through a 3D seismic volume where you have tweaked the colour scale so that all low amplitude events are blanked out, it could be the response of a gas sand.

Now that would be beautiful 🙂

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**Author:** ![thoughtful](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/thoughtful/32/9230_2.png) [@thoughtful](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/thoughtful)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 7:19pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/3 "2020-11-18T19:19:59Z")

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It looks like a random walk you’ve shared earlier. All 3?

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**Author:** ![Puck\_Mendelssohn](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/puck_mendelssohn/32/11849_2.png) [@Puck\_Mendelssohn](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Puck_Mendelssohn)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 9:05pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/4 "2020-11-18T21:05:28Z")

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Dunno what it IS, but it looks like an Outer Hebridean island, full of both freshwater lakes and lakes with shallow sea connections. Reminds me of North Uist/Benbecula/South Uist somewhat.

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**Author:** ![Dan\_Eastwood](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/dan_eastwood/32/2368_2.png) [@Dan\_Eastwood](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Dan_Eastwood)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 9:17pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/5 "2020-11-18T21:17:59Z")

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Was going to say random walk but Valerie beat me to it. Maybe a representation of a folded protein?

[Google search for similar images is no help!](https://www.google.com/search?safe=active&sa=X&hl=en&tbs=simg:CAESwQEJCmkuroYCQqAatQELELCMpwgaYgpgCAMSKK8UpAqjCqIKqwq4FKAK-wPzBp8KyDfCJ8Y9xzeOKf0zjSmaKaE0mykaMM06FkSpkK2PFZiqIcy8RMaBONvTTW3bYO8tXb1kjamhYmc4M3VmPpAfeBIQSKrLbCAEDAsQjq7-CBoKCggIARIERCf08gwLEJ3twQkaLgoWCgNkb3TapYj2AwsKCS9tLzAyN2N0ZwoUCgNhcnTapYj2AwkKBy9tLzBqancM&sxsrf=ALeKk03-j9jcXbIYPNCwOCQ9b_a-cc2TWQ:1605734072621&q=dot&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwjZgILIgY3tAhUDbc0KHcWUA1IQjJkEegQIEBAB&biw=1222&bih=632)

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**Author:** ![Puck\_Mendelssohn](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/puck_mendelssohn/32/11849_2.png) [@Puck\_Mendelssohn](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Puck_Mendelssohn)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 9:48pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/6 "2020-11-18T21:48:31Z")

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> [@Dan\_Eastwood](#):
>
> Google search for similar images is no help!

And, as it happens, it brings up a lot of Pokemon images. I sometimes think that Pokemon is the source of many “evolution” misconceptions; in particular, in Pokemon it is the individual, not the species, which “evolves.”

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**Author:** ![Dan\_Eastwood](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/dan_eastwood/32/2368_2.png) [@Dan\_Eastwood](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Dan_Eastwood)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 9:58pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/7 "2020-11-18T21:58:59Z")

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> [@Puck\_Mendelssohn](#):
>
> And, as it happens, it brings up a lot of Pokemon images. I sometimes think that Pokemon is the source of many “evolution” misconceptions; in particular, in Pokemon it is the individual, not the species, which “evolves.”

Technically the Pokemon metamorphize, even if it’s called evolution. I’m pretty sure those misconceptions long predate the advent of Pokemon.

Totally off topic, but I used to play the card game with my son when he was young. It turns out there are some surprisingly deep strategies to building a winning deck. We figured out some good combinations, and my son ruled the Saturday Morning Pokemon Cub. 😉

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**Author:** ![davecarlson](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/davecarlson/32/2139_2.png) [@davecarlson](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/davecarlson)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 9:59pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/8 "2020-11-18T21:59:16Z")

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Reminds me of biogeographic niche models showing estimated habitat suitability on a map using color intensity.

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**Author:** ![Timothy\_Horton](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/timothy_horton/32/9410_2.png) [@Timothy\_Horton](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Timothy_Horton)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 10:23pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/9 "2020-11-18T22:23:48Z")

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I would say it looks like the latest Republican attempt at [gerrymandering](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerrymandering) but I wouldn’t want to be accused of political bias. 🙂

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**Author:** ![swamidass](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/swamidass/32/3_2.png) [@swamidass](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/swamidass)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 11:39pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/10 "2020-11-18T23:39:20Z")

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So here are some more clues:

 ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/5/5244030afea121b7bcd3da8110979e310b89fa0f.png) ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/a/ac7aadc7fec74438be0c4e6e4afe02206d5fb4a4.png)

 ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/b/bda71e624a4212f0c2c17915051e0197efb3bb75.png) ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/1/192cb6051bd997560a3d624ae0dc655d706acfdc.png)

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**Author:** ![BrushyCanyon](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/brushycanyon/32/9198_2.png) [@BrushyCanyon](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/BrushyCanyon)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 11:45pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/11 "2020-11-18T23:45:38Z")

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Different iterations of a [fractal](https://mathworld.wolfram.com/Fractal.html) generator?

Paging Dr. Mandelbrot.

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**Author:** ![Puck\_Mendelssohn](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/puck_mendelssohn/32/11849_2.png) [@Puck\_Mendelssohn](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Puck_Mendelssohn)\
**Post date:** [November 18, 2020, 11:52pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/12 "2020-11-18T23:52:35Z")

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Judging from the first image, I think it’s the “Keep On Truckin’” guy.

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**Author:** ![pnelson](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/pnelson/32/876_2.png) [@pnelson](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/pnelson)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 1:11am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/13 "2020-11-19T01:11:13Z")

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Self-avoiding segment of DNA

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**Author:** ![thoughtful](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/thoughtful/32/9230_2.png) [@thoughtful](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/thoughtful)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 4:31am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/14 "2020-11-19T04:31:53Z")

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The cosmic web. 🤣 J/k

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**Author:** ![swamidass](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/swamidass/32/3_2.png) [@swamidass](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/swamidass)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 4:32am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/15 "2020-11-19T04:32:40Z")

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Here is another clue:

 ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/5/5bc0446f13e0a3c38ddd75fc7f0a43b670dc6395.jpeg)

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**Author:** ![Art](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/art/32/3805_2.png) [@Art](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Art)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 4:37am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/16 "2020-11-19T04:37:32Z")

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Ant’s nest.

> [@swamidass](#):
>
> Is it beautiful?

To an ant, yes.

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**Author:** ![Roels\_Major](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/roels_major/32/9083_2.png) [@Roels\_Major](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Roels_Major)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 6:43am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/17 "2020-11-19T06:43:34Z")

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Fractal. Self similarity. And theory of everything (graph).

> **[Finally We May Have a Path to the Fundamental Theory of Physics… and It’s...](https://writings.stephenwolfram.com/2020/04/finally-we-may-have-a-path-to-the-fundamental-theory-of-physics-and-its-beautiful/)**
>
> How does our universe work? Scientist Stephen Wolfram opens up his ongoing Wolfram Physics Project to a global effort. His team will livestream work in progress, post working materials, release software tools and hold educational programs.

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**Author:** ![T\_aquaticus](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/t_aquaticus/32/1249_2.png) [@T\_aquaticus](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/T_aquaticus)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 4:27pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/18 "2020-11-19T16:27:46Z")

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My bias towards molecular biology makes me think of DNA and protein condensates for the higher resolution image.

This image . . .

 ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/0/0f85d9373c63459ee8ce79da98d56c91cc157629.png)

. . . makes me think of “Game of Life” simulations.

[https://playgameoflife.com/](https://playgameoflife.com/)

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**Author:** ![DarrenG](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/darreng/32/755_2.png) [@DarrenG](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/DarrenG)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 8:18pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/19 "2020-11-19T20:18:42Z")

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It is starting to remind me of a map of great britain. There was is interesting post on facebook. Is it ok for me to copy it here? I often lose things on face book, and it is something I want to be able to find again.

J.  
Why can’t it be all three?

D.  
The way I read the questions it can.  
Is it ordered? (Y/N)  
Is it random? (Y/N)  
Is it beautiful? (Y/N)  
to which I would answer: can’t tell, can’t tell, not to me.

J  
Part of what lies behind my question is that randomness has several things it can mean, one of them requiring indeterminism, at least one of them compatible with both determinism and indeterminism, and theological views of divine sovereignty require thinking everything is ordered, even random things, and one of those definitions of randomness is compatible with that. I also think biblical views of God require expecting everything God to do to be beautiful, and in one sense God does everything, so that seems to lead to a yes answer to all three, all from theological premises, without even looking at the picture or knowing what it is.

D  
That is an interesting perspective on beauty which I hadn’t considered.  
If I have understood you correctly the reasoning goes like this:

1. biblical views of God require expecting everything God to do to be beautiful
2. in one sense God does everything
3. therefore everything is beautiful

There is certainly a lot for me to ponder in that. I think I was about 11 years old when I first saw Saturn through a very large telescope at the observatory. It was so beautiful that it literally took my breath away. Saturn was so bright and crystal clear, and made an amazing contrast to the inky blackness, while the background stars sparkled like diamonds. It was a moment that changed my perspective on life. The physical laws that were followed in its creation are the same laws as those behind a bird dropping hitting my windscreen, yet that produces a very different response for me. Why, I wonder?

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**Author:** ![AllenWitmerMiller](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/allenwitmermiller/32/2519_2.png) [@AllenWitmerMiller](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/AllenWitmerMiller)\
**Post date:** [November 19, 2020, 8:45pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/a-puzzle-for-the-forum/12474/20 "2020-11-19T20:45:16Z")

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> [@DarrenG](#):
>
> It is starting to remind me of a map of great britain.

That was my very first thought—perhaps in a few years after climate change radically raises sea-levels. But then I considered the topography of Great Britain and had to rule it out.

My second thought was that it looks a lot like the suspected melanoma that my dermatologist removed from my hip a few weeks ago. (The pathologist later declared it a benign nevus with severe atypia.)

My third thought was that I have a great dry cleaner who removes stains like that for an extra ten bucks.

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