# Did Moses Write the Pentateuch? **URL:** \ **Category:** Conversation\ **Tags:** Theology\ **Created:** [August 18, 2020, 4:02pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458 "2020-08-18T16:02:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 7

**Author:** ![riversea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bbe5ce/32.png) [@riversea](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/riversea)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2023, 5:49pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/122 "2023-02-18T17:49:27Z")

> [@John\_Harshman](#): > > This is ChatGPT’s response: > > It is not clear what you mean by “comprehending” in this context. However, I will try to address the two parts of your question separately: > > 1. Moses and Abraham: Moses and Abraham are both important figures in the Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam), but they lived at different times and were not contemporaries. Abraham is believed to have lived around 2000 BCE, while Moses is believed to have lived around 1200 BCE. Moses is considered a prophet in Judaism and Islam, and is credited with leading the Israelites out of slavery in Egypt and receiving the Ten Commandments from God. Abraham is also considered a prophet in these religions, and is known for his covenant with God, in which God promised to make him the father of a great nation. > > It is not accurate to say that Moses “comprehended” Abraham, as they did not interact directly. However, both figures are important in their respective religions and are believed to have played significant roles in the history and development of the faith. > > 1. Zera: I am not sure what you mean by “Zera.” If you could provide more context or clarify your question, I would be happy to try to help you understand. @OneGod @John_Harshman @John_Harshman I never used a ChatGPT before. Maybe it’ll help me or will it not. As I understand about Moses leaving Indus Valley. - It appears that chatGPT seems confused with my asking about the word comprehension - I promise if I ever use chatGPT that I’ll explain like you did this is what chatGPT wrote. - Here it seems your chat GPT john was confused about comprehension, how come? - Example today there’s people who comprehend Abraham and even teaches about Abraham - How did they comprehend? - This makes sense to me the word comprehend, how come GPTchat was confused, as you shown @John_Harshman what GPTchat said, was confused about the word comprehend - So I was asking about Moses and Moses comprehension and due to Moses left Indus Valley and travel to Yisrael yes there’s a Y - there I wrote Indus Valley what would GPTchat say about Indus valley, I never used GPTchat so I don’t know. - I learn that too., Yisrael it’s Yisrael not Israel, what does Israel even mean, actually it was Canaan, then Yisrael - so moses comprehension of abraham and people now comprehension of abraham has it changed or same oh @Tim you asked, about yadav and yadavas is it same word, I learn in an email as I asked, yes same word, I learn the letter A can be at the end or taken off and it’s the same word - This is what I learn in an email - my response in an email as I was asking same question as @Tim as I was seeking about this. this response: yes all of me wrote this. Wow, now I understand why “Rama Ram” and “Yadava Yadav” are the same word. It’s because the letter “a” can be at the end of the word or not, and both are the same word. Thank you for explaining. Yes, I can see why knowing Hindi is so important, so I understand. You wrote, “The Hindi word ending with the sound a is translated both ways, for example, ram and rama.” this is in the email where I learn about the letter A **The hindi ending with the sound a is translated both ways, for example, ram and rama.** ---

**Author:** ![RonSewell](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/ronsewell/32/6194_2.png) [@RonSewell](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/RonSewell)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2023, 3:45am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/123 "2023-02-19T03:45:44Z")

> [@OneGod](#): > > Please explain why we find large percentage of parallels between Hebrew and Indus signs. See attached paper. Please get real. The opposite is apparent. > [@OneGod](#): > > Pleas explain how you “prove” that the sun shines. What motivates all this nonsense? Do you even care about history, archaeology, or haplogroups, or is all this to somehow have Krishna somehow be extended to include the wellspring of Judaeo-Christian-Muslim religions or some such fancy? ---

**Author:** ![John\_Harshman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/john_harshman/32/1121_2.png) [@John\_Harshman](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/John_Harshman)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2023, 3:46am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/124 "2023-02-19T03:46:29Z")

> [@riversea](#): > > Then how do people comprehend Abraham now? If Moses couldn’t comprehend Abraham, back when? I think your limited fluency in English is not adequate to this discussion. And I believe the rest of us don’t understand you any more than ChatGPT did. > [@OneGod](#): > > See attached paper. I don’t believe a paper was attached. ---

**Author:** ![Tim](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/tim/32/9381_2.png) [@Tim](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Tim)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2023, 4:15am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/125 "2023-02-19T04:15:39Z")

> [@riversea](#): > > oh @Tim you asked, about yadav and yadavas is it same word **No I did not.** The issue was whether they are the **same population** – **NOT** whether they were given the same (or very similar) name. History is rife with **unrelated** populations being given the same name, e.g.: - both Native Americans and natives of India have been called “Indians” - the original “Prussians” of the Baltic coast in pre-Christian times and the “Prussians” of the Kingdom of Prussia and later the German Empire. What you need to do is demonstrate that the modern Yadavs (a label that only goes back a couple of centuries) is the **same population** as the Yadavas of ancient legend. ---

> [@OneGod](#): > > > [@Tim](#): > > > > We have been presented **no evidence** of R-M124 in the _ancient_ Indus Valley, and only a survey based on an _extremely small sample_ from one modern population in Bihar > > Please read the paper again. R-M124 **is** widespread in India. [My emphasis] I will note that you said “ **is** widespread in India” **NOT** “_ **was** _ in India” – the paper is about **modern** populations **not ancient** – and my question is about ancient populations. [Addendum: on closer examination, [that paper](https://www.pnas.org/doi/full/10.1073/pnas.0507714103) **does not even cover the Indus Valley** , which is in modern-day Pakistan, and the paper only covers states within modern-day India – making it _even more_ **irrelevant!** ] Given that populations move, and genes spread, over the millennia, it is the genetic makeup of the **ancient** Indus that matters, not modern India. > [@OneGod](#): > > Please explain how it got there? As we have **no evidence** that R-M124 is basal in the ancient Israelite population, and a whole heap of **evidence** (which you have failed to address) that it isn’t, R-M124 would appear to be **completely irrelevant!** As I said before: > [@Tim](#): > > It can therefore be seen that **R-M124 is a complete red herring** – so I wish you’d stop harping on about it. [Addendum: But I have in fact found an answer to your **irrelevant** question: > The question remains of how distinctive is the history of L1 relative to some or all of R1a1 and R2 representatives. This uncertainty neutralizes previous conclusions that the intrusion of HGs R1a1 and R2 from the northwest in Dravidian-speaking southern tribes is attributable to a single recent event. Rather, these HGs contain considerable demographic complexity, as implied by their high haplotype diversity. Specifically, they could have actually arrived in southern India from a southwestern Asian source region multiple times, with some episodes considerably earlier than others. [[1]](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1380230/) So it seems that R-M124 came to India from southwest Asia.] > [@OneGod](#): > > > [@Tim](#): > > > > the ancient Israelites spoke Hebrew, a **Leventine** language, > > Please explain why we find large percentage of parallels between Hebrew and Indus signs. See attached paper. Easy: > The Kassites and the Phoenicians met the Late Harappans in Bahrain. There’s an explanation in that very paper. Though I’m not sure that this is even relevant, given that the evidence seems to be that the [Paleo-Hebrew alphabet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleo-Hebrew_alphabet) derives from the [Phoenician alphabet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenician_alphabet) which in turn derives from the [Proto-Sinaitic alphabet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-Sinaitic_alphabet), which are **all native to the area.** But I would note that writing systems are far more portable than language. We speak a Germanic language, yet use Romano-Greek script and Arabic-derived numerals. A number of countries have changed writing system even in the last century. This quibble _ **still** does not_ address my original point: > [@Tim](#): > > You have completely **failed** to even attempt to explain why the ancient Israelites spoke Hebrew, a **Leventine** language, **unrelated to the languages spoken in the ancient Indus valley**. > [@OneGod](#): > > > [@Tim](#): > > > > Indus is **completely awful!** > > Pleas explain how you “prove” that the sun shines. Please explain why you have not addressed my explanation **WHY** “Indus is **completely awful!** ” > [@OneGod](#): > > Please show a reference to Mitsrayim outside the Bible \< 1300 BCE. Given that the oldest \*proto-\*Hebrew writings date back only to the 11th-10th Centuries BCE, this is a **ludicrously silly** request. The Bible itself isn’t that old. > [@OneGod](#): > > Please explain why no Mitsrayim in Egypt \< 1300 BCE. Because “Mizraim” is a _Hebrew_ word, **not an Egyptian word!** > [@OneGod](#): > > Please show route of the Exodus through these volcanic sites. Please reread this: > [@Tim](#): > > 1. This is _easily explained_ by the fact that the Exodus narrative is widely regarded as being **legendary NOT historical** – a point you have **completely failed to address!** > 2. [Addendum] Even if the Exodus narrative is not _wholly_ legendary, the fact that it was written several centuries after its purported events leave it open to having ahistorical elements enter into the narrative. I would note that insisting that “Pharaoh” is an ahistorical element, but that the volcano, etc _are_ historical is a fallacious [Special Pleading](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_pleading). > [@OneGod](#): > > > [@Tim](#): > > > > Misr is the [Arabic word for Egypt](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D9%85%D8%B5%D8%B1). > > Please show me evidence of Arabic \< 1300 BCE. 1. Please demonstrate how what word Arabic used for Egypt “\< 1300 BCE” is **relevant**. 2. I rather doubt we have **any** surviving Arabic writings this old. > [@OneGod](#): > > > [@Tim](#): > > > > [Osarseph](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osarseph)? > > Please give evidence, not from 3c BCE; but from 1500 BCE. **Hell no!** 1. Your claim was “No character parallel to Moses in Egyptian literature” **NOT** “No character parallel to Moses in Egyptian literature **before 1500 BCE** ” – you are attempting to move the goalposts here. 2. There is **no evidence** that _Moses himself_ existed in Hebrew literature that far back. So this issue, as with _nearly every other issue you have raised_, is **utterly irrelevant!** > [@OneGod](#): > > > [@Tim](#): > > > > And as I’ve explained before legendary parallels are commonplace and thus **absolutely worthless** as evidence. > > Pleas explain how you “prove” that the sun shines. I’ll do so **after** you explain _all_ the parallels between _all_ the gods and heroes in _all_ the world’s myths and legends. 😃 Trying to cherry-pick a single set of parallels out of that vast number, and declaring that _only they_ are meaningful and worthy of explanation is a a fallacious [Special Pleading](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_pleading). ---

**Author:** ![riversea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bbe5ce/32.png) [@riversea](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/riversea)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2023, 8:21pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/127 "2023-02-19T20:21:56Z")

> **[Did the Yadavas have a conflict over straw in the Indus Valley? – Common...](http://www.commonprophets.com/43-mistrayim-was-located-in-egypt-and-moses-led-the-exodus/)** # Did The Yadavas Have A Conflict Over Straw In The Indus Valley? Krishna abandoned Dwarka after ill-omens appeared there; and led the Yadavas to Prabhasa. Here the Yadavas indulged in a quarrel and killed each other. Arjuna came to know of this soon and came to Dwarka. At this time Vasudeva told Arjuna…. “Your friend [Krishna] spoke to me as follows after sons, grandsons, brothers and friends were killed by each other: ‘I will live… in some pure place and following the rules will wait for my end.’ Krishna has left towards an unknown direction after leaving me with the children” (_Mahabharata_ _,_ _Mausala Parva_ 6:17, 24-25.). This “unknown direction” could be that of Yisrael. We make this suggestion because the Bible says that Moses led the Yahudis from Mistrayim to Yisrael during the Exodus. This narrative could be recorded in the Hindu texts in Krishna going away in an unknown direction. ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/a/a277307213ed8031c2d9171469649a8552ff30f7.jpeg) ### **Moses lived in Egypt?** The Biblical scholars, however, believe that Mistrayim was located in Egypt and Moses led the Exodus from there. The Hebrews wanted to go to the desert for 3 days to worship the Lord. The King refused to let them go. Instead he increased their work load. He told his supervisors: “You must no longer give straw to the people for making bricks as before. Let them go and collect straw for themselves. But you must require of them the same quota of bricks that they were making before” (Bible, Exodus 5). This conflict led to the Exodus. It is clear from this that straw was an important ingredient of making the bricks at Mitsrayim. We can use this information to ascertain whether Mitsrayim was located in Egypt or the Indus Valley. ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/b/bcfc117fa385d33959f877cef4c6af3d9d06ef9e.jpeg) ### **Stone and mud brick construction in Egypt:** The main construction material used in ancient Egypt was stone. Picture of a stone block used in the construction of a pyramid. Indeed, mud bricks were used to construct the living quarters. Even here, the amount of straw used in making of the mud bricks was very small: The [Biblical Archaeology Society Staff](http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/ancient-cultures/daily-life-and-practice/how-to-make-a-mudbrick/)says that only half pound of straw is added to one cubic foot mud to make mud bricks. This works out to be merely 0.6 per cent straw by weight in making mud bricks. ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/b/bee5b053f2066d7e20d0eb2141f61cf5932cc56d.jpeg) ### **Baked bricks in the Indus Valley:** In comparison, baked bricks were the main construction material in the Indus Valley. The important buildings such as citadel where the elite lived was made with baked bricks. The excavations at Chanhu Daro are shown at Picture 4. One can see profuse use of baked bricks. A brick kiln owner in Rajasthan said that straw used as fuel for baking constitutes of about 50 percent of the cost of production. ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/d/d7066b5092e69ad2a4c96b771c9120173688e320.jpeg) The Biblical story matches more with the Indus Valley than with Egypt because of two reasons. One, the construction material for the important buildings in the Indus Valley was baked bricks while it was stone in Egypt. Two, because large quantity of straw is required to make baked bricks. Thus, the conflict over the collection of straw is more plausible if it took place in the Indus Valley. ![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/8/8655bfa9878244364706260c258421bb07a6e838.jpeg) ---

**Author:** ![RonSewell](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/ronsewell/32/6194_2.png) [@RonSewell](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/RonSewell)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2023, 12:32am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/128 "2023-02-20T00:32:00Z")

> [@RonSewell](#): > > What motivates all this nonsense? Do you even care about history, archaeology, or haplogroups, or is all this to somehow have Krishna somehow be extended to include the wellspring of Judaeo-Christian-Muslim religions or some such fancy? Bingo. From the referenced site [commonprophet.com](http://commonprophet.com) > The Abrahamic and Hindu Religions have common > heritage in the Indus Valley. Adam, Noah, Abraham > and Moses lived here and Moses led the Exodus from > the Indus Valley to Yisrael. The Hindus know these same > persons by the names of Swayambhu Manu, Indra, > Vaivaswat Manu, Rama and Krishna. > [@riversea](#): > > This narrative could be recorded in the Hindu texts in Krishna going away in an unknown direction. Maybe all the references to Krishna are redacted. That is how @OneGod dismisses the association of Pharaoh with Egypt throughout the Old Testament. Charlton Heston has as much credible claim to being Moses as Krishna. ---

**Author:** ![Tim](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/tim/32/9381_2.png) [@Tim](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Tim)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2023, 1:26am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/129 "2023-02-20T01:26:34Z")

> [@riversea](#): > > Did The Yadavas Have A Conflict Over Straw In The Indus Valley? Given that we have **no evidence** that the ancient Yadavas _even existed_ outside legend, do we really care? [Addendum: > [@riversea](#): > > Krishna abandoned Dwarka after ill-omens appeared there; and led the Yadavas to Prabhasa. Here the Yadavas indulged in a quarrel and killed each other. Arjuna came to know of this soon and came to Dwarka. At this time Vasudeva told Arjuna…. “Your friend [Krishna] spoke to me as follows after sons, grandsons, brothers and friends were killed by each other: ‘I will live… in some pure place and following the rules will wait for my end.’ Krishna has left towards an unknown direction after leaving me with the children” I will note that **none** of this even establishes that any of this occurred in the Indus valley, **even in legend**. Both [Dwarka](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwarka) and [Prabhasa](https://web.archive.org/web/20220526084019/http://hindupedia.com/en/Prabh%C4%81sa) are in Saurashtra in Gujarat, whereas the Indus valley is in Sindh.] > [@riversea](#): > > The Biblical scholars, however, believe that Mistrayim was located in Egypt and Moses led the Exodus from there. Balderdash. 1. Biblical scholars _do not_ “believe that Mistrayim was located in Egypt”, they **know** that “Mizraim” is the Hebrew word for Egypt. 2. They _do not_ “believe that … Moses led the Exodus from there” – the scholarly consensus is that the Exodus is ahistorical – i.e. _it did not happen_. ---

**Author:** ![riversea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bbe5ce/32.png) [@riversea](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/riversea)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2023, 3:34am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/130 "2023-02-20T03:34:15Z")

Here are some other perspectives on the Indus Valley in this forum. > [@Alice Linsley on Genesis and the Indus Valley Civilization](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/alice-linsley-on-genesis-and-the-indus-valley-civilization/629): > > I asked a “theological anthropologist” (a real thing) a question: The Indus Valley Civilization arises early in history. It appears there was trade between Ancient Mesopotamia and them. Are there plausible references to them in, for example, Genesis? What are the implications for Theological Anthropology if the IVC was known to the author but exuded from the Table of Nations (Genesis 10-11)? She responded with a wealth of info I want understand more deeply. Wonderful questions to consider. Thanks, @Swamidass! All the people in the so-called “Table of Nations” (Gen. 10) spoke languages in the same family. They had "the same language, with the same vocabulary” (Gen.11:1). These languages are in the Afro-Asiatic group, the oldest language group. The lists found in the Table of Nations refer to later populations. Genesis 10 is an attempt to trace the dispersion of peoples after the flood. Mohenjo-daro had a population of about 40,000 during Noah’s time and afterwards (no evidence o… ---

**Author:** ![Tim](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/tim/32/9381_2.png) [@Tim](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Tim)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2023, 2:57pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/131 "2023-02-20T14:57:57Z")

@riversea: You must remember that Alice Linsley was writing from the viewpoint of [Theological Anthropology](https://www.fuller.edu/next-faithful-step/resources/theological-anthropology/), which Wikipedia describes under the label of [Christian anthropology](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_anthropology), a sub-field of Theology, not of the [social science](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_science) of [Anthropology](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthropology). Under that viewpoint, yes, the “Table of Nations” is a _real_ thing, they did all _really_ speak the same language before Babel, Noah and Nimrod were _real_ people, etc, etc. However, _within that viewpoint_, the Bible _really did_ mean “Egypt”, “Pharaoh”, the “Sinai”, the “Nile”, etc when it wrote, in Hebrew, “Mizraim”, etc. Of course if you venture beyond this viewpoint, things may look very different, as @John_Harshman said: > [@Alice Linsley on Genesis and the Indus Valley Civilization](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/alice-linsley-on-genesis-and-the-indus-valley-civilization/629/28): > > I’m curious whether anything in this thread is actually true. Looking _outside_ this viewpoint, we find opinions that [the Harappans spoke Dravidian](https://web.archive.org/web/20060904034700/http://www.harappa.com/arrow/stone_celt_indus_signs.html), a non-Afro-Asiatic, and in fact non-Indo-European, language unrelated to Hebrew and other Semitic languages. You also find that you have to find non-Biblical evidence to support Bibilical claims about the existence of volcanoes, orders-about-straw-in-bricks, etc, etc in the Exodus narrative – because stepping outside this viewpoint puts _all_ purely-Biblical claims into question. So _neither_ accepting the Theological Anthropology viewpoint, nor rejecting it, helps the Israelites-from-Indus argument. To support that argument you need to pick and choose claims from within that viewpoint and from rejecting that viewpoint – which leaves you with a [Special Pleading](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_pleading) fallacy – as your claims are neither fully consistent with accepting that viewpoint nor with rejecting it. ---

**Author:** ![John\_Harshman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/john_harshman/32/1121_2.png) [@John\_Harshman](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/John_Harshman)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2023, 3:36pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/132 "2023-02-20T15:36:45Z")

> [@Tim](#): > > Looking _outside_ this viewpoint, we find opinions that [the Harappans spoke Dravidian](https://web.archive.org/web/20060904034700/http://www.harappa.com/arrow/stone_celt_indus_signs.html), a non-Afro-Asiatic, and in fact non-Indo-European, language unrelated to Hebrew and other Semitic languages. That opinion is based on very thin speculation. In reality we have no real idea what language is represented in Harappan cylinder seals (which is where most of the signs come from). Some Dravidian language is a reasonable guess, but that’s all it is. ---

**Author:** ![Tim](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/tim/32/9381_2.png) [@Tim](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/Tim)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2023, 3:31am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/133 "2023-02-21T03:31:10Z")

> [@John\_Harshman](#): > > That opinion is based on very thin speculation. In reality we have no real idea what language is represented in Harappan cylinder seals (which is where most of the signs come from). Some Dravidian language is a reasonable guess, but that’s all it is. Yes, but is there any significant evidence-based, as opposed to Bible-based, opinion that they spoke a language “in the Afro-Asiatic group”, as Alice Linsley suggested? ---

**Author:** ![John\_Harshman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/john_harshman/32/1121_2.png) [@John\_Harshman](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/John_Harshman)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2023, 4:49pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/134 "2023-02-21T16:49:06Z")

I don’t recall Alice Linsley ever saying anything I found credible. ---

**Author:** ![riversea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bbe5ce/32.png) [@riversea](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/riversea)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2023, 4:49pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/135 "2023-02-21T16:49:08Z")

> [@Tim](#): > > Yes, but is there any significant evidence-based, as opposed to Bible-based, opinion that they spoke a language “in the Afro-Asiatic group”, as Alice Linsley suggested? - So Alice describes Africa, while Bharat describes the Indus Valley, where the Hebrews left. Am I understanding correctly, @OneGod What differentiates Alice’s thinking from Bharat’s? - About languages: Bharat told me about Pieo and how languages spread. German spread westward, while Sanskrit spread eastward. However, who wrote the Pentateuch while languages were evolving? ![bharatwrote](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/2X/6/6ed239c2bdf0cb718a51cfd86052fa00b83912f2.jpeg) ---

**Author:** ![John\_Harshman](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/john_harshman/32/1121_2.png) [@John\_Harshman](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/John_Harshman)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2023, 8:26pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/136 "2023-02-21T20:26:54Z")

Davidian isn’t Afroasiatic. Please consult an actual reference on language families. ---

**Author:** ![riversea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bbe5ce/32.png) [@riversea](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/riversea)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2023, 9:45pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/137 "2023-02-21T21:45:09Z")

> [@RonSewell](#): > > Charlton Heston has as much credible claim to being Moses as Krishna. - I found **Charlton Heston** movie clip on YouTube, and how did they change a sceptre into a serpent? Have you ever turned a sceptre into a serpent before? I never have. - **CLIP DESCRIPTION** : Moses (Charlton Heston) goes to the court of the Pharaoh (Yul Brynner) demanding he let his people go. Moses turns his sceptre into a serpent, which swallows the serpents of the Pharaoh. [![](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/peacefulscience/original/3X/f/4/f4e7f2cf7d67eb28e999e6a4fe37c24d9d1ccd2a.jpeg "Let My People Go - The Ten Commandments (1/10) Movie CLIP (1956) HD") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahkwQhQZWG8) To see it clearly one has to watch it on youtube. after you click on video I think on the lower right click on youtube and then you’ll see it clearly ---

**Author:** ![swamidass](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/swamidass/32/3_2.png) [@swamidass](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/swamidass)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2023, 4:58pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/138 "2023-02-26T16:58:15Z")

> [@riversea](#): > > Here are some other perspectives on the Indus Valley I found out pretty quickly that those ideas (which I was just summarizing for a new participant) are idiosyncratic. ---

**Author:** ![riversea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bbe5ce/32.png) [@riversea](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/riversea)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 4:15am UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/139 "2023-02-27T04:15:29Z")

> [@swamidass](#): > > I found out pretty quickly that those ideas (which I was just summarizing for a new participant) are idiosyncratic. @swamidass Can you direct me to this summary you’ve written? I appreciate this. ---

**Author:** ![swamidass](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/discourse.peacefulscience.org/swamidass/32/3_2.png) [@swamidass](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/u/swamidass)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 2:00pm UTC](https://discourse.peacefulscience.org/t/did-moses-write-the-pentateuch/11458/140 "2023-02-27T14:00:44Z")

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