Speir Explains His YEC View

(John Harshman) #106

I think you’re confusing @T_aquaticus with @r_speir. But if there had actually been a flood @r_speir would have ice cream all over his face, and yet his face is clean. That would be the analogy.

(Mikkel R.) #107

Yeah I did.

(r_speir) #108

All noise and whining.

I absolutely will not get into a food fight with you over your ‘evidences’ against mine. I don’t want to hear about a “10,000 year old campfire (campsite) in Mexico”.

There are ample evidences for a global Flood in recent Earth history. Then there is the biblical account.

Unembellished. Detailed. Credible.

It is precisely that second piece that is woefully absent on your side. In fact, none of your claims are backed up by a historical record. That fact will always leave you on the defensive and always in doubt. You will take it to your grave that you might have been wrong all along – a fear I do not possess.

But I think this may be what’s really going on anyway. I just made the claim that Adam and Eve may have borne children in the Garden, and some of you don’t like it.


Present them to us. Because this is the first time we’re hearing about this “credible evidence”.

(30-year veteran) #110

I’ve heard about it on literally hundreds of occasions. But I’ve never seen it. Every single time, that evidence has proved on inspection to be insubstantial, inconclusive, misrepresented, non-existent or some combination of those.

I expect that to happen this time too.

(John Harshman) #111

Such as?

There’s your problem. No, not credible in the least. Have you even considered the heat released by enough rain to cover the tallest mountains?

Projection? Nobody else here is in any doubt that a global flood never happened. All the evidence tells us that. You’ve already admitted there’s no physical evidence of a flood, and yet if one had happened there would be. And there are those Egyptians who failed to notice it. Of course if you were right, all of the human fossil and archaeological record would be post flood; but that really screws up your timeline. Nothing you have claimed makes any sense at all from any perspective. Well, except one: you believe Genesis, and nothing else is relevant, la la la.

Why doesn’t Genesis mention them at all? It would seem like a big deal.


No it isn’t. I personally witnessed the entire 4.5 billion year geologic history of the Earth, and there was no global flood. We now have a historical record, because I say so.

(Matthew Pevarnik) #113

You are a credible eyewitness too. 20/20 vision. Perhaps if you can manage to claim divine inspiration you can be even more reliable.

(Retired Professor & Minister.) #114

I have known a few Young Earth Creationists who have conceded that there is “very little evidence for a global flood” but explained it as God wiping out all of the evidence. Why? “Because God hates sin and God forgives sin. The Bible says that he forgives and then remembers our sins no more. Wiping out the evidence of that global flood judgment was part of blotting out the remembrance of that sin.”

(I don’t explain 'em. I just report 'em.)

(John Harshman) #115

Yes, of course. And that’s why the bible never mentions it. So, have any of those creationists said this in print/electrons?

(George) #116


I don’t know if I can say “We don’t believe you …” because I don’t know who the “we” is on this thread. But I know I can say “I don’t believe you, and neither does my nephew.”

What do you think is the best evidence for a global flood? I wouldn’t think someone who rejects Young Earth Creationism would be so fixated on an illusory Global Flood!

(John Harshman) #117

Don’t forget that he’s a young life creationist. He has to explain the thousands of feet of fossiliferous sediments somehow, and it has to have happened within the last few thousand years…

(Retired Professor & Minister.) #118

I’ve seen it on Internet forums and have been told this face to face. I’ve not seen it in a theological journal. (No surprise there. This viewpoint seems to be associated with fans of Kent Hovind, Ray Comfort, and similar “populist” commentators.)

(John Harshman) #119

Do you know whether Hovind, Comfort, or any of those commentators has made such claims?

(Greg) #120

So many questions…like how in the world do we explain multi hundred foot deep salt deposits?
That one confounds old earth and young earth proponents. And how do we explain the formulation of fossils in the first place? Rapid burial in a catastphic flood seems best explaination. And what about a geologic column that is similar in places throughout the world that has marine fossils embedded throughout?

I admit that geology does not paint an understandable enough picture that should arouse confidence for anyone to declare themselves the authoritative historian, but one thing @r_speir has going for him is that he has Scripture on his side. If God can create the cosmos, flooding the earth, rearanging the terrain, and altering the physical laws that run the universe would be easy for Him …
as a kid putting the next block on his lego house.
I dont believe in a God who subjects himself to nature. I believe in the God of Scripture who transcends, controls and alters it with a wink. Think about that- the size of our universe and God is everywhere and He created it. The amount of energy put out by our sun is mind blowing, and there are millions of those only in our galaxy…God created all of that “in the beginning”. Smart scientists think they know stuff, but do they really? I honor smart scientists for wanting to find a cure for cancer but stuff about the history of our planet??-i think i will place my savings in the God of Scripture bank account and so if God says there was a worldwide flood, then i believe it.

(Timothy Horton) #121

LOL! You have a lot of nerve still pimping Wise’s nonsense after he was caught in the bare faced lie about European mammal fossils, and the complete 100% BS non-explanation he barfed up about angular unconformities.

I asked before but you avoided the question - are you ready for me to show you the next geologic feature impossible to form in a one year one-time Flood?

(John Harshman) #122

That video is actively painful. Kurt Wise is the honest creationist? That video was snake oil from beginning to end. He should be really ashamed. Presumably nobody in the audience knew anything about paleontology or geology, and just shouted “amen” whenever the spirit took them.

(Retired Professor & Minister.) #123

I don’t know.

(Greg) #124

And on the other hand, articles like this

reveal the astounding lack of logic that naturalistic universal common decent evolutionists use to try to explain the gear system in the mandibles in beetles.

Here is the thing, if one is an atheistic leaning naturalist, then everything from entropy to little things like a gear system in beetle mandibles or bacterium flagellum is very difficult to explain in a rationalistic, statistically honest way. If one takes the smallest step towards the existence of the One who created mass energy and who designed bio machines, then this opens the floodgates towards possibilities that science may not even be able to trace or that, possibly turns science on its head. And this might just equate to guys like Wise actually being more right than previously thought.

So call me stupid and unintelligent. Thats ok. Im a big boy. I beg folks to at least consider that in the realm of possibilities, just maybe the hyper scientific approach of determining truth that is thought of as so intelligent may actually be unwise and offering false hope.

(John Harshman) #125

I don’t think that article even mentions how evolutionists try to explain the gear system, does it?

Gladly. You certainly show no abilities at anything other than testifyin’.