How do you FILL the dirt?
It’s interpretation is: “FILL the LAND”
Oceans first … true
Then atmosphere … true
Then land … true
Then plant life … true
Then sea life … true
Then land life … true
Then humans … true
If there wasn’t already so much laid out correctly, no amount of “cherry-picking” or “force-fitting” would make it seem so.
The more you say it … the less it makes sense. You should stop saying it.
When lined up with the actual evolution of life, it makes apparent what it was describing.
The mention of birds along with the life from the sea is the key to this.
sea life > amphibeans > reptiles > dinosaurs > birds ( wave 1 - cold blooded/egg laying)
sea life > amphibeans > reptiles > proto-mammals > mammals ( wave 2 - warm blooded/ placental birth)
Neeeeeaaaaaahhhh- no.
Oceans first … FALSE. Earth was a rock before it was a rock covered by water.
Then atmosphere … FALSE. Earth had an atmosphere before it had an ocean.
Then land … FALSE… the rocks were always first.
Then plant life …FALSE… there was microscopic marine life before anything… and algae wasn’t first.
Then sea life … AT LAST we get a fresh start… but then BIRDS come from an ocean
in the sky.
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Oof, not even sure where to start.
“Earth was a rock before it was a rock covered by water.” … That’s the Earth’s crust. Out of everything specifically named in creation, the ocean came before all of it.
“Earth had an atmosphere before it had an ocean.” … yes, the Earth had an atmosphere from the time the planet’s mass was large enough to create a strong enough gravitational force to retain an atmosphere.
But the atmosphere as we as humans know it now did form where it’s listed in sequence.
“the rocks were always first.” … Earth’s crust and the continental land masses are not the same thing
“there was microscopic marine life before anything… and algae wasn’t first.” … readers would not have known what that is. Plant life they know.
Something else that should be noted, for those who can’t read the article directly.
Verse 2 sets up the point of view of creation. It says God’s spirit was “on the surface of the waters”.
If it were possible to stand on the surface of the planet and watch creation from there. Everything it describes from that point on is what you would see.
Your most recent post about God hovering over the Earth makes for a nice image. But the reportage from that vantage point is still quite wrong. What that vantage point appears to be reporting are the islands appearing in the Nile delta as the annual Nile flooding recedes.
I don’t know where you go for your cosmology milk shakes… but Earth was a solid before it acquired water over its 75% of the Earth’s surface.
It did not start as a ball of water. The Egyptians imagined land being revealed by subsiding waters because they saw this same sequence every year as the Nile flood waters lowered, revealing more and more islands in the Delta.
Presumably the same sight was seen by the Mesopotamian culture with their dual river system.
So… starting with the chaos of water is very poetic… but also very wrong.
The atmosphere was here before oceans covered most of the continental plates. So the sequence for air is wrong. And of course the celestial waters is also wrong (I just know you are going to argue that mists and clouds represent celestial waters… < No. It didn’t).
You say that the ancient audiences would not have known about algae in the oceans. Well, I suppose so. But they do know about sea weed, right? And there was seaweed before there was anything on land.
As to your comments about the Earth’s Crust … I don’t even know what you are trying to explain. The Crust is the uppermost layer of the Earth, except where the ocean does not fill up depressions. The Crust is the top layer of the Lithosphere, which is the two-layered part of the Earth’s surface that is divided into moving plates. The layer below the Crust is the “Upper Mantle”, also called the asthenosphere. This layer flows more like a fluid than either the crust above (because the Crust above is shielded from the Earth’s inner heat by the layers below) or the layer below the asthenosphere. Even though this layer may be hotter than the layer above, it flows less like a fluid because of the increased pressures it experiences. But I digress. The only part of the crust that the ancients would not have directly experienced would be the part of the crust that is covered by water.
"The lithosphere, above, includes the crust and the uppermost part of the mantle.
Below the lithosphere is the asthenosphere. Although solid, the asthenosphere can flow like a liquid on long time scales. Large convection currents in the asthenosphere transfer heat to the surface, where plumes of less dense magma break apart the plates at the spreading centers. The deeper mantle below the asthenosphere is more rigid again. This is caused by extremely high pressure.
Nothing but cherry-picking and distortion. Genesis never mentions the atmosphere. You never mention the creation of the sun, moon, and stars. Plant life evolved after sea life. You left out birds, the waters above the earth, the firmament, etc.
Nope, nothing like that in Genesis. There are no “waves”; There’s sea animals and birds on day 5, land animals on day 6. No matter how you try to force it, the story doesn’t fit the facts. Even your two waves as described don’t separate until amniotes split into two groups. Each “wave” is presented as a ladder, which it isn’t. And there are warm-blooded and cold-blooded animals, egg layers and live birth, even placentas, on both sides.
It’s worse than that. Genesis doesn’t mention algae, just land plants, specifically angiosperms.
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Re: Atmosphere
Yes, there was an atmosphere. The Primordial Atmosphere. But what formed after the oceans was our modern atmosphere.
Re: Water above/below
Two things here. First, once sun began to break through the dense atmosphere (“Let there be light”), once the water vapor was able to condense into ocean, then began the building up of the oxygenated atmosphere with two primary ingredients; oceans and light.
“In fact, the primitive Earth long remained covered in darkness, wrapped in dense burning clouds into which continuously poured water vapor from volcanic emissions. When temperatures finally cooled sufficiently, the clouds began to melt into rain, and the primordial atmosphere produced storms of unimaginable proportions, under which the Earth groaned and flowed. At first, falling on incandescent rock, the rain evaporated, but the evaporation gradually cooled the crust until the water could accumulate in the depressed regions of the Earth’s surface, forming the first oceans.” - Palaeos Hadean: The Hadean Eon
This oxygenated atmosphere caused a separation above/below in that it created the transparent atmosphere we exist in now. Before that the dense clouds of the previous atmosphere would have come all the way down to the ground. This is why there was a sun, but no light initially.
The second thing that happened with the oceans and sunlight at this point was the establishment of the Earth’s water cycle (water above/below).
Re: Continents
The continents as we know them today began to form around the same time as the Great Oxidation Event, around 2.5 billion years ago at the beginning of the Proterozoic eon (2500 to 542 mya). There was continental crust that formed prior to this, roughly 4 billion years ago, but all that’s left of these are ‘Cratons’, which make up the core that today’s continents, the continents relevant to humans, formed around.
No, they’re not called “waves”, but by what’s described it can clearly be seen to be the case.
And God said, "Let the waters bring forth… “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply on the earth.”
So, as the first wave continued on through procreation on its mission to “fill the waters” and “multiply on the earth”, the next wave was set into motion as the first continued …
And God said, "Let the earth bring forth…
That first wave eventually led to the evolution of birds. But they weren’t realized until after the initiation of the second wave.
It should also be noted, this is exactly how Hugh Ross describes it.
Only if you’re determined to force-fit the text and the science. “Be fruitful and multiply” is an instruction to the various species to make more of themselves. Nothing to do with evolution. Birds are created on the 5th day, not just “potentiated”. If there were a wave started on the 5th day it would lead to mammals as well as birds; there is no separate wave for mammals.
Why should that be noted? Is Hugh Ross competent in biology and biblical exegesis? Apparently not.
Far be it for me to argue with an avian phylogeneticist on this point, but you’re saying that biological life evolved into placental birthing mammals, then back to egg-laying birds? Or is it more accurate to say birds branched off before the mammalian branch?
It’s more accurate to say that birds and mammals are both taxa at the later end of a branching tree of life, along with all the other extant taxa. Mammals are the only living members of Synapsida, one of the two main branches of Amniota, while birds are among the living members of Sauropsida, the other main branch, that also includes turtles, crocodylians, lizards, and rhynchocephalians. There is no “wave” that includes fish and birds but not mammals. Day 5 is specifically about “fish” (which includes whales) and birds, while day 6 is about all land animals, the majority of which are not mammals and many of which are more closely related to birds than to mammals, while others are equally related to both. In other words, your story doesn’t fit biology in any way.
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Re: Whales
The actual Hebrew words used here that are translated as “whales” are ‘e-thninm’, which means ‘the monsters’, and ‘e-gdlim’, which means ‘the great ones’.
It’s a translator many centuries later who said “whales”.
Doesn’t it fit? Wouldn’t all the land animals that are not mammals have come along between life from the sea and birds? Mammals came from animals already on the land. Which makes sense if God said “Let the earth bring forth…”. They branched off of reptiles who were already on the land.
Gen 1:2 - Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
“In fact, the primitive Earth long remained covered in darkness, wrapped in dense burning clouds into which continuously poured water vapor from volcanic emissions.” - Palaeos Hadean: The Hadean Eon
I’m simply pointing out that the state of the earth as described in verse 2 matches up with a period in the late Hadean. With the oceans existing, shrouded in darkness.
So what do you think “the monsters” and “the great ones” are? You will note that they live in the sea.
No, but for different reasons depending on what you mean by “between”. And the 6th day isn’t just about mammals. It’s about all land animals. “Creeping things” are definitely not mammals.
During that stretch of evolution I imagine it could refer to all sorts of things, including dinosaurs, in route to birds.
But within the context of speaking of things the contemporaries of the era would be familiar with, things like what’s described as the Leviathan come to mind.
Definitely? Wouldn’t you say mice “creep”.
Wow… what is your motivation?
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you say parts of the bible that most say is right, you say is wrong.
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then you say parts of the Bible that most people think is wrong… is actually right.
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then you do handstands and throw flash powder into the camp fire… trying to reconcile the whole mess.
You are WAYYYYYY off the reservation now… and the more you say, the more you are shredding whatever credibility you had to start with.
I havent seen so much effort to levitate an impossibly heavy load since Henry Morris wrote me a personal response about why he didn’t have answers to explain all of his Flood theory!