We Are Mystified by Eric Holloway

[swamidass (S. Joshua Swamidass)]

@EricMH

There is a self contradictory set of claims being made.

1. One hand, you claim that natural law cannot produce new information (mutual information), only intelligence can.
2. On the other hand, you claim when natural laws produce new information (mutual information), this is because intelligence is what set up the laws.

I don’t claim #2.

What I do claim is that when we think natural laws are producing new MI, then it will always turn out on further analysis the MI came from somewhere else where it pre-existed. Chance and determinism can never produce a net increase in MI. This is just the law of information non-growth.

Help me square these statements with what you say next…

@EricMH

Replication does seem to depend on prior MI. Basically, there is no way to get MI for free, so in general any instance of MI is indicative of ID

In your view, do you believe that (A) DNA replication requires the direct input of Intelligence every time a cell, virus, or plasmid replicates? Or you do believe that (B) DNA replication is just what happens, according to natural law, as the cellular “machinery” works on DNA?

If A, this is consistent with vitalism, as you have claimed as your view before. What evidence do you have the DNA replication requires the direct intervention of intelligence each and every time it happens? Is it merely the information non-growth theorem? Is it not more likely you just are misapplying it?

If B, then it seems to contract what you’ve said earlier. It seems then that natural law can increase empirical (not the non-observable kind) MI without any difficulty. That would seem to directly contradict your claim that natural law cannot increase emperical MI.

To be clear, empirical MI can increase why the non-observable sort of MI can stay constant. Though I’m not sure its true, I’m fine with that claim. At question here is using proofs regarding an unobservable, theoretical MI to deal with Emperical MI. That is the move that is invalid. This does not mean that Information Theory for practical problems is invalid. It just means your use of the theory is invalid for the problems you have selected.