YEC and The Doctrine of Perspicuity of Scripture

Then your appeal that I should consider you learned in the Scriptures because you have studied under an unsaved heretic is not particularly convincing.

Are ā€œunsaved hereticsā€ unable to teach us anything about Hebrew exegesis? And what exactly about my professorā€™s writings did you find heretical? Or is this just a reckless accusation?

Are you saying that all rabbinical scholars are heretics? Are you really and truly unaware that the Apostle Paul was a rabbinical scholar?

@PDPrice, I am delighted that you have joined this forum. Your participation here is quite interesting.

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Perhaps they can, perhaps they canā€™t, but if Iā€™m going to look for a good teacher on Scriptural exegesis the very first question Iā€™m going to ask is ā€œAre they a believer or a heretic?ā€

Are you saying that all rabbinical scholars are heretics?

I guess that depends upon what you mean by ā€˜rabbinical scholarā€™. I specifically asked if this person was an unbelieving Jew so I could understand what you meant. Your answer seemed to imply that they were. Did I misunderstand you?

Are you really and truly unaware that the Apostle Paul was a rabbinical scholar?

Yeah, Iā€™m aware. Thatā€™s why I asked you the question I did. What is the answer?

This is probably redundant, but what YECs donā€™t get is that the truth that comes from the reality of the data in Godā€™s word cannot conflict with the truth that comes from the reality of the data in Godā€™s creation.

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Creation is not propositional revelation. Scripture is. Manā€™s stories about what they believe happened in the past can never conflict with the revelation of Scripture (and be right, that is). Human scientists are not on the level of God.

(I even had a YEC ask me once for chapter and verse where the Bible says that truth comes from reality. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:)

Genetic fallacy

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Truth is truth.

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No, I donā€™t think you understand what a genetic fallacy actually is. Is it a ā€˜genetic fallacyā€™ for employers to ask to see a resume before hiring someone?

Um. It seems you donā€™t. Your statement implied this personā€™s interpretations were wrong because he was an unbelieving Jew. That is 100% the genetic fallacy.

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If you call it revelation, then you are admitting that God has revealed truths through his creation. Excellent. So why then do you choose to ignore what God has revealed in his creation? Why do you treat it as unreliable?

Human theologians are not on the level of God. So why do you distrust the ā€œinterpretationsā€ of human scientists while trusting the interpretations of theologians when they happen to agree with your own opinions?

What about theologiansā€™ stories about what they believe happened in the past?

You surely agree that both theologians and scientists are human beings who are capable of being fallible. So why are you treating scientistsā€™ interpretations of Godā€™s creation as untrustworthy while theologiansā€™ interpretations of Godā€™s scriptures (at least, the theologians you like) are fine?

For that matter, why is there so much disagreement even among evangelical theologians about what appears in theology textbooks while there is tremendous consensus among scientists in most fields about what appears in science textbooks?

Youā€™ve been dodging my questions and those of many others on this forum. We are getting weary of answering your questions (some of them quite irrelevant to the discussion) while you ignore ours. For example, why do you think a rabbinical scholar is a ā€œhereticā€ and unable to teach Hebrew grammar and exegesis appropriately? (You are tripping over several classic logic fallacies here.) Moreover, the word ā€œhereticā€ doesnā€™t mean what you appear to think it meansā€”but letā€™s not start even more rabbit trail tangents while you evade our questions.

You can start with the questions above about scientists versus theologians and their fallibility.

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You ignored my question, didnā€™t you? Is it wrong for a hospital to assume I donā€™t know how to perform surgery just because I have never studied at medical school?

Need we compile a long list of the questions you have ignored in this entire thread? Seriously?

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@AllenWitmerMiller Whoops, it looks like you just totally ignored my last questions to you and skipped forward to responding to what I wrote talking to somebody else.

Meanwhile, Iā€™m preaching this Sunday so I have to get some work done. When I come back, I hope to find that you will finally start answering the questions posed to you.

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That takes guts to say something like that right after obviously ignoring a question you didnā€™t want to answer.

I didnā€™t find it worth answering but oh well. Lol you werenā€™t conducting a job interview. Do you need to know if people have qualifications before hiring them? Yes. But that isnā€™t what you did. You went straight to ā€œoh this is a guy is an unbelieving Jew. Canā€™t take him seriously.ā€

Iā€™ve asked you about ten you have completely ignored. Still waiting on that paper, big dog.

And not just this thread. How Science Works: One Anomaly Versus A Mountain of Evidence - #86 by DaleCutler

In context, Miller was attempting to bolster his own credibility by saying he had studied under this person. So in that context, my response was appropriate. It was not the genetic fallacy. I am not going to go to a heretic to explain anything about scriptural exegesis to me, just as I want my doctor to have a sound set of credentials before Iā€™ll let them practice medicine on me.