Does Summers et al Validate Behe?

[swamidass (S. Joshua Swamidass)]

@Edgar_Tamarian

why not think the otherwise, that Behe had fully engaged with several scientists and found them unconvincing. Yes, they disagree with Behe, but all claims made by those scientists were disputed by Behe himself.

That is true too. He could have said that, no problem. Instead, Behe, just left the controversy out entirely, and claimed to have put it all away. That is not acceptable standards for a scientist writing for the public. He needed to at least acknowledge the controversy, and explain it. This is even more problematic because he RELIES on these arguments going forward in his book.

Also, the review is our assessment. In our assessment, he did not mention in the book (objective fact) all the ways people have refuted (he might say challenged) his arguments. In my view, his appendix on the coagulation pathway is disturbingly misleading. He does not engage legitimate critiques, and claims that IC has no standing challenges. This is just false. He can dispute it, but he has to actually mention critiques to dispute them.

@Edgar_Tamarian

What I am trying to say that it is just a difference in words order, but the difference in words order predicts your disposition who is right in the first place. Who is right is not depends whether or not Prof. Moran agrees or disagrees, but primarily depends on observational data, experimental results, but here comes interpretation of the data, what makes interpretation right? someone’s philosophical predisposition?

He could have been upfront about the controversy without conceding that he agreed. That would have been more plausible of an approach. Instead, he just ignored that there are several refutations out there, some of which he has (inadequately) responded to, and many that he has not.

@Edgar_Tamarian

i am glad to see criticism that has not been answered by Behe yet

Two key ones he has not responded to yet are:

1. @Art’s work. We reached out to Behe asking him to respond several times. This has been on the web for about a decade, so we weren’t springing this on him from no where. Behe and the limits of evolution | The RNA Underworld

2. Perhaps the most important critique of his work is Draper 2002, which convinced Alvin Plantinga that Irreducible Complexity was a flawed argument. No response from Behe; he just ignores it. You get a summary here: ex-apologist: Behe's Darwin's Black Box: Paul Draper's Critique. Some of the same concepts are included here: Which Irreducible Complexity?

I hesitate to add this in, because I am not 100% sure has not responded to this one yet. It is possible I am incorrect here, but I have looked around for it. It is notable, for example, that this is among the strongest references we gave (and the first one), but remains unmentioned by Behe at this time.

3. As far as I know, he has not responded to this article, which was published alongside the article Darwin Devolves was based upon: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/49764027_Irreducible_Incoherence_and_Intelligent_Design_A_Look_into_the_Conceptual_Toolbox_of_a_Pseudoscience.

His brief and unofficial response to the T-urf13 example by @art was a fairly stunning dismissal. I won’t repeat it here, because it was secondhand through one of his supporters. These are three examples of critiques to which he has studiously avoided response and engagement. We have been asking at PS several times to clarify himself, and he has refused.

Now, if you can take this list back to ENV and ask Behe to engage, we would be very grateful to you. It is unfortunate it has gotten to this point. We tried several times in several ways to engage with him, and he refused. I was hopeful he would deal with these questions head on in Darwin Devolves, but he did not.