No way, DI didn’t have the money to mount an effective appeal. They were pretty much left for dead. I am really surprised that they have survived this long. Would have thought they would have morphed into something else or just faded away.
@Patrick… there is ALWAYS MONEY to make an appeal in the behalf of God. But without standing there was nothing to spend it on.
God always seems to be short on cash. Why is that?
Talk to the Hamsa…
Judge Jones was fooled by a literature bluff and bought the lies of evolutionists over the ID experts. It is all documented
Read what Dr Behe had to say about it:
A Response to the Opinion of the Court in Kitzmiller vs Dover Area School District
Conclusion
The Court’s reasoning in section E-4 is premised on: a cramped view of science; the conflation of intelligent design with creationism; an incapacity to distinguish the implications of a theory from the theory itself; a failure to differentiate evolution from Darwinism; and strawman arguments against ID. The Court has accepted the most tendentious and shopworn excuses for Darwinism with great charity and impatiently dismissed evidence-based arguments for design.
All of that is regrettable, but in the end does not impact the realities of biology, which are not amenable to adjudication. On the day after the judge’s opinion, December 21, 2005, as before, the cell is run by amazingly complex, functional machinery that in any other context would immediately be recognized as designed. On December 21, 2005, as before, there are no non-design explanations for the molecular machinery of life, only wishful speculations and Just-So stories.
ID has been around since the ancient Greeks. Only ignorance says it is a spawn of Creationism. Science cannot be decided by Courts. It is dumb to even think that it could be.
ID has more science than blind watchmaker evolution, which is total unscientific claptrap. Only ignorance says that ID is religion as it doesn’t say anything about worship.
ID is science for the simple reason it makes testable claims, unlike blind watchmaker evolution. ID’s claims can be tested, confirmed or falsified. Science 101
Look, I can tell you how to test the claim that ATP synthase arose by means of intelligent design. I doubt that anyone can say how to test the claim that it evolved by means of blind watchmaker evolution. Blind watchmaker evolution is an untestable and metaphysical position that doesn’t belong in science.
See also: Traipsing Into Evolution
Thankfully the judge’s ruling only applies to that little school district.
Ever since you said this forum is lame and that you were leaving you post even more. Hmm.
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The federal government is as equally enjoined to respect the “free exercise of religion” as it is to respect the “not establish” clause. Therefore, it’s role with regard to ID is not as one-sided or strict as you’d like it to be, @Patrick . That’s just your philosophical overreach talking. We are not required to drink that Koolaid.
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Unfortunately for the original school district… the ID teaching materials were identical to RELIGIOUS teaching materials but with the word Creationism replaced with the words Intelligent Design.
@swamidass, I don’t believe Joe is an ID Deist. He sounds like your everyday Old Earth Creationist to ne.
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There wasn’t any teaching materials. Just a pro-ID book the students could check-out from the school library. And it wasn’t about getting ID into the classroom, either. There was just a simple, factual statement that was to be read to the class.
Also seeing that Creationists, old and young earth, rely on the Bible and I do not, I cannot be a creationist. If the Bible were somehow proven to be a hoax my life would not be affected at all. Creationists cannot say the same
I still don’t understand the need to label someone. Does that make it easier to dismiss their arguments without even considering them?
I find it difficult to believe you are so passionate about design AND you are an atheist.
He is a deist, not an atheist. We worked it out here: Newton's Four Rules. Also he is a suspended deist, for one week, for another incedent.
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Oh good, We (atheist, nones, and agnostics) will not allow anyone within our ranks that claims to be an atheist but secretly has faith in an IDer. We will not allow such heresy and blasphemy. He is an AINO (Atheist in name only). We send people like him to a special place for re-indoctrination - a secular university library.
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Joe is not just a Deist… he seems to be rather a Militant Deist. He becomes quite insistent on God-Designed nature… but adamant that God no longer does anything… it’s all humans (with God-designed abilitues).
God is NOT part of the real time Cosmos. I’m not really sure what his approach uniquely resolves. But anyone who starts making rules for why God REFUSES TO DO ANYTHING MORE… has quite an uphill struggle in metaphysics.
ID proponents assert Design to PROVE God exists…but for Joe, God might as well now be dead.
Here is a quote from the other thread you referenced:
"Wow, indeed. I do not see any reason to invoke God when it is not required. It isn’t that I can imagine some story explains things. It is that an Intelligent Designer was not necessary to solve the problem beyond giving us the ability to do so.
I am not a Christian. Jesus is not God. If Jesus is God then there wasn’t any sacrifice at his crucifixion.
You are free to believe God is acting even when it seems like randomness. Me, I am more of an evidence person."
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Go and learn the truth that God is both transcendent AND immanent. Seriously; look up the terms; I have not made a typo with either of those two ordinary, yet theologically useful, terms. The evidence is there.
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And now he is permanently suspended. Goodbye @JoeG! It was fun while it lasted. Making a Temporary Suspension Permanent - #2 by gbrooks9
And i thought we didnt do permanent expulsions…