Introducing Paul Price

[swamidass (S. Joshua Swamidass)]

What do you admire about them and why do you wish you could still be a YEC?

[Patrick]

@PDPrice Paul, I went to Georgia Tech in Atlanta from 1976 to 1980 earning a Bachelors and Masters degrees in Electrical Engineering in just four years. Coming to Atlanta from New Jersey as a Catholic kid of age 18 was a real culture shock for me. A few things that I had to adjust to were 1) what a dawg was, 2) what a grit was, 3) Catholics weren’t Christian, 4) the civil war wasn’t about slavery, 5) a Yankee wasn’t a baseball fan, 6) fellowship was football, 7) Bourbon wasn’t alcohol, 8) Jesus was coming to Georgia soon, 9) impossible to meet girls without going to a church.

[Michael_Callen (Herculean Skeptic)]

@r_speir

I admire YEC’s and really wish I could still be one. I may disagree politely with those here, but I make it a rule not to disparage or engage in a fight with any YEC present. (By the way, that same rule does not necessarily apply to others here – for instance, an open evolutionist of any stripe.)

I can’t stop thinking about this comment and have to ask. I’m really struggling with making sense of this. You disagree with the efficacy of two different positions. You believe that neither one is correct, and yet you will argue against one and (sometimes) for the other? That would bother most people, internally, I would think. It seems that a superior ability to handle (manage) cognitive dissonance must be in play here. I mean no disrespect, but your comment alone (not even considering managing such a philosophy in an active conversation) causes my tiny brain to hurt.

[stcordova (Salvador Cordova)]

@PDPrice

Thanks very much for the introduction. It took me a while to notice it, sorry. I came here on the recommendation of @stcordova,

Paul and I don’t always see eye to eye, but we’re committed to trying to work together. The major difference is I tend to de-emphasize world-view and try to work with the data and measurments we have in hand, and if the YEC/YCC is lacking the data that would vindicate our case, I’m much quicker to say, “YEC/YCC models are presently unsupported by the data we have in hand.”

I encouraged Paul to participate here for the same reason I participate here, so that we can get review of the materials we write with the hope we can teach our audience with high quality information and represent the views of people as accurately as possible even when we disagree with them.

I’ve certainly learned some things that are outside traditional textbooks and creationist literature by participating in forums, and it has motivated me to take formal classes in biology for the last 3 years, and over a decade ago, to enroll in an MS in Applied Physics program and get a accredited diploma in that field.

Since there are professors in relevant fields here, I encouraged Paul to visit and interact with subject matter experts, especially those holding different world views.

[John_Harshman]

@stcordova

“YEC/YCC models are presently unsupported by the data we have in hand.”

Now if only you could go that one more step and say “YEC/YCC models are presently falsified by the data we have in hand,” that would be even better and more consistent with the actual data.

[r_speir]

@John_Harshman

Now if only you could go that one more step and say “YEC/YCC models are presently falsified by the data we have in hand,” that would be even better and more consistent with the actual data.

Why do you do this? I mean, really. As an evolutionist you constantly jump to conclusions - major ones - about the beginning of life and the development of life on this planet. Conclusions that you absolutely cannot prove, not even with your weak so-called science. So again I ask, why do you make comments like this as if you are some kind of being of superior intellect or possessing some kind of private inside edge on the evidence?

[r_speir]

@Michael_Callen

You believe that neither one is correct, and yet you will argue against one and (sometimes) for the other?

Please clarify this statement you made. I want you and all here to know that I never ever will argue in favor of evolution. That wasn’t possibly what you were insinuating was it?

[Michael_Callen (Herculean Skeptic)]

@r_speir Apologies for the confusion. No, I don’t know why you would think that either.

There are two positions that you don’t believe in as stated above:

@r_speir

I admire YEC’s and really wish I could still be one. (added by me: But you cannot because you disagree with the science.)

@r_speir

I never ever will argue in favor of evolution. (added by me: Because you disagree with the science.)

And yet, you will argue vehmently against the one (evolution) and even appear to be in support of the other (YEC). This is what I find challenging to comprehend. Both philosophies are directly opposed to your own, and yet you’ll argue against one and cuddle with the other. I don’t understand that. It seems that the truth should be the truth. And if you believe that something is not so, you should state your case against it. Politely, as you say.

[John_Harshman]

@r_speir

So again I ask, why do you make comments like this as if you are some kind of being of superior intellect or possessing some kind of private inside edge on the evidence?

I have no private edge. It’s available to anyone, just provided they bother to look. While “prove” isn’t something we say in science, I would say that the evidence favoring deep time and ancient life is sufficient to falsify YEC to the point that it’s perverse to say otherwise. You, on the other hand are unwilling to look at or discuss that evidence.

[Timothy_Horton]

@r_speir

Why do you do this? I mean, really. As an evolutionist you constantly jump to conclusions - major ones - about the beginning of life and the development of life on this planet. Conclusions that you absolutely cannot prove, not even with your weak so-called science. So again I ask, why do you make comments like this as if you are some kind of being of superior intellect or possessing some kind of private inside edge on the evidence?

Not knowing how life started has nothing to do with the fact a 6000 year old earth and a literal global covering Noah’s Flood / Noah’s Ark have been conclusively disproven.

It has nothing to do with “superior intellect” or “inside edge” and everything to do with merely being honest about the consilience of physical evidence.

[PDPrice (Paul Price)]

@Michael_Callen

What was it like to live in Korea and Russia? How long were you there? Did you speak the language? That must have been an amazing experience.

Well they’re two very different places. Korea is similar to Japan culturally (which I lived in for about 2 months as an exchange student), though the food is very different and is an acquired taste. I now love Korean food though, and I make kimchi at home.

Entering Moscow for the first time I thought I was in North Korea. Aesthetically, it’s not a pretty place, which is what I would expect of the former world capital of atheistic marxism.

I did learn to appreciate the very unique and special character of the Russian people. And I learned to love borsch and kvass, and to appreciate the quality of good outerwear.

I learned to read and write the characters of both languages but I didn’t have much time to pick up vocabulary as I was teaching English most of the time I was there. Maybe one day I’ll get the time to study Russian more for fun.

[Michael_Callen (Herculean Skeptic)]

Twenty years ago I had heard of kimchi, but didn’t really know much about it. I had no idea what a big thing it was in Korea. In our home town, an enormous Korean Market opened and one of the things that they sold were these machines the size of clothes dryers for the fermentation of cabbage to kimchi. They were several thousand dollars and I knew then that these folks were into kimchi big time!!

[PDPrice (Paul Price)]

@Michael_Callen

the things that they sold were these machines the size of clothes dryers for the fermentation of cabbage to kimchi. They were several thousand dollars and I knew then that these folks were into kimchi big time!!

Yeah, those are kimchi refrigerators. If you want to get really high-tech you can use those. They are also useful for making winter kimchi that is fermented very slowly. But normal kimchi is not high-tech. All you need is a pot, like what you would use to make sauerkraut.

[Michael_Callen (Herculean Skeptic)]

I love the stuff… and with every increasing year, we learn more and more about the benefits of probiotics. I think it is so interesting when humans stumble across things that end up to be surprisingly beneficial.

@PDPrice

But normal kimchi is not high-tech. All you need is a pot…

Funny that you say this… the store carried them the first year, and then stopped doing so. I actually pictured people walking past them to buy a big jar instead.