No human being’s sincere beliefs are a complete waste of time to go over, even if only to understand better.
Stop guys. Step away from the keyboard. Take a deep breath and come back to this in a couple hours.
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Doc, why don’t you call Dr. Bart Ehrman and talk to him about the issue. He is in the Department of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill. If you are a scientist, then woo us with something scientific. You will NOT destroy my faith; therefore, think about yourself. Now I am going off the line. Why don’t you too? You cannot insult or hurt me in any way. You must not have much to do as a scientist; otherwise, you would not be after me all the time. So, you are an Engineer and an adjunct professor in New Jersey.
I am. I will not be back. I know there are good people and scholars here, but one person wants to always start trouble, and it isn’t I. God bless everyone here.
God bless, Charles, and know you’re welcome back here anytime. We’ve all of us run into our own “brick walls,” at times here. But, we’re bridge builders, and demolished walls make good bridge-building material.
Cheers!
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Flagged, but worth responding to. On Ed Feser’s blog, a Fundamentalist writes of Stephen Hawking:
Indeed what did Hawkings ever discover/create worthy to be remembered a decade from now? Nothing i say!
It looks like a skeptical parody, but it’s not - he is a real poster. Of course, he’s immediately trounced by the thinking Christians on the site, but the point is that, not knowing the first thing about what he is talking about, he mouths off anyway, and embarrasses all the better informed people who visit the site - including, in all probability, other Young Earth Creationists.
Now, on a site like this I have no doubt that many of us have studied Revelation - I personally have taught it to groups maybe half a dozen times, and written a book-length study. I stand in awe of the knowledge and literary skill of John, quite apart from his awesome spiritual insight and his ability to motivate readers into practical action - but that’s because I took the trouble to understand him.
So I read Patrick’s remark, and see exactly the same mental processes as my Fundamentalist uses - uninformed opinion posing as insight. The difference is, that the latter doesn’t pretend to be educated. Which makes me even more embarrassed.
Presumably the aim in both cases is to make us realise how foolish we were not to see through St John (or Stephen Hawking). We secretly know Revelation is nuts, but are too brainswashed by religion to admit it without some “bright” pointing out the obvious.
But instead, I think of a tiny song by an obscure British band of my youth, whose brief lyrics I’m never quite sure whether to dub “uncharitable” or just “resigned.”
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This moderate Baptist will continue praying for the whole world including you, Patrick. Does the number ninety years mean anything to you? I am young enough to be your son, old man. Oh, I like a book named I love Jesus and accept evolution. A very fine professor north of us wrote it. Perhaps you have heard of the book. When you write about me, you make me sound like the Reverend Trask on the old TV series “Dark Shadows.” Shame on you, because you know that that is not true. I am more like Barnabas Collins, a very fine gentleman. Adieu!
Oh, if you want to know my eschatology, I am a Partial-Preterist Amillennialist. William Hendriksen was a grand theologian. He received his PhD in Theology from Princeton Theological Seminary and gained more faith.
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Jon, you are exactly on target. I wrote my comment about Revelation to mirror back to a bible thumping retired Baptist Deacon who just spouts out bible verses including chapter and verses as that they are some how authoritative. He uses them as verbal weapons. It is basically hate speech disguised as “speaking God’s word”. I see it all the time. Especially with regard to LGBTQ issues. And Baptists are the worse offenders. They quote bible verses that say homosexuals should be killed. Then they moderate it by saying that we love the sinner but hate the sin. But the damage as already been done.
Regarding the Book of Revelation, it shouldn’t be used to threaten an atheist. It is as meaningless to us as saying we are going to hell after we die because we are atheists. Plan ole hate speech.
Regarding the Revelation, my only serious look at it was forty years ago in college at Georgia Tech. Hal Lindsey’s book was all the rage, and I read the book and I read Revelation as well. As a Catholic Agnostic from the North, it was laughable to me. I pretty much wrote a book review of Hal Lindsay’s book where I didn’t say that Hal Lindsay was a nut case on drugs, but the writer of Revelation was a nut case on the 1st century equivalent of LSD. It got a chuckle from my Northern Catholic Friends but the Fundamental Southern Baptist engineering students were applauded.
Seriously, if you really think that we can scientifically discuss the validity of Revelation as prophesy of things that could happen in our collective life spans (50 years), I am all for it. It will be fun.
A great many of the people Joshua hopes to attract to Peaceful Science.Org and the “GA Adam” scenarios are Bible Thumping Deacons.
Figure out a new approach.
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As soon as you figure out a new approach to your guided cosmic rays.
I don’t. But then Hal Lindsay didn’t study Revelation properly either. But Charles only made an assertion about eschatological events pictured therein (not nearly so offensive as some of your own statements - I’m not impressed by the “hate-speech” stuff - Charles is no Westboro Baptist, and neither are any Baptists I’ve ever met).
And the eschatology in question falls the other side of a transformation that would require a new science, so that would be a fruitless discussion… though think outside the scientism box, and you could find the conversation fruitful.
Very true. It is best if we can explain when they say something that offends. They can adjust in response. Otherwise it can be profoundly confusing. They just don’t know or understand what created problems.
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Hello, old man. It sounds like you do not know your eschatology. I said I am a Partial Preterist Amillennialist. Hal Lindsey was an Independent Baptist and not a Southern Baptist. He was also a Pretribulational Premillennialist. So, you do not know your eschatology. A Catholic Agnostic? That sounds like a New Deal Republican. Perhaps that’s why Herbert Hoover liked FDR-New Deal Democrat.
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I was just thinking about Preterists. Partial preterism may be a better way to read Revelation. It seems much less like LSD tripping that way, and perhaps better informed by context.
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Don’t waste your life doing such silly things as wasting time praying. It is useless and meaningless. There are so much better things to do with your life. Go out and enjoy it. Its summer, go to the beach. Go out to lunch with a friend. Go talk with all the atheist under 30 years old. You undoubted know a lot of them without even realizing it.
Does the number ninety years mean anything to you?
No. What does the number 90 mean to you?
well, if you are alluding to a potential paternity suit, please send me a picture of your mom when she was young. Also if you can, please send me a DNA sample as I have mine in a database for easy comparison.
Regarding the “Dark Shadows” reference, I never like that TV show. I much preferred the Addams Family. Gomez and Mortissa Addams were a great example of American Family Values.
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I believe that chapters 1-19 have already happened in 70AD. Chapter 20, the millennium, is the Church Age from the death of our Lord to the Second Coming. Chapter 21 is eternal Heaven, when heaven and earth become one.
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Of course Charles is no Westboro Baptist, but he is programmed with his subtle and not so subtle “use the Bible as a verbal weapon” mentality. He hasn’t learned that it doesn’t work any more. He is being laughed at by most people when he does it. The world has changed. Quoting Bible verses don’t have that power anymore.
Ah, but in this case he’s the guy who has read the book being laughed at by those who know better because they haven’t.
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They are not laughing at me; on the contrary, an Agnostic Catholic. There goes the New Deal Republican again. Also, Charles and Betty Miller were both my legal and natural parents. At least, I can spell Bart. I am sure Pontifex Maximus will make you a knight of the Papal See. Also, are you Patrick M. Trishita. If I misspelled your last name, I do apologize. Also, Patrick M lives in New Jersey and is about ninety years old. He is a retired
College Professor.
You are not responding. Have I come upon something interesting? I wonder. Please answer. I truly miss your company.
Wrong again. Patrick M. Trischitta was my late father. He was a World War II Veteran and fought in the Phillipines and New Guinea. He was a fine man and good father. He died in 1992 at the young age of 66. He would have been 93 this month, if he had the heart medical technology and care we have today.
I am Patrick R. Trischitta age 60, living in Holmdel NJ. (note that picture of me in the left hand corner was taken February 15, 2018, so that is what a 60 year old atheist looks like.) If you are ever in the area, I invite you to come with me to tour the Horn Antenna that was used to discover the Cosmic Background Radiation confirming the Big Bang 13.8 Billion years ago. I will also take you to lunch (my treat of course as atheist always pick up the tab for lunch) at the Big Bang Cafe at the new BellWorx technology center. I assure you that the tour will be far more enlightening and entertaining than going to Ark Encounter in Kentucky and far more factual. Take the whole family, especially the young people, as I love talking science with young people.
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