I Got Critiqued by YouTuber Gutsick Gibbon | Evolution News

Earlier this year, a popular evolution YouTuber, Gutsick Gibbon, or Erika, created a video response to my post here at Evolution News, “Do Statistics Prove Common Ancestry?” I had reviewed a paper by Baum et al. (2016), “Statistical evidence for common ancestry: Application to primates,” and how it presents a flawed and weak argument for separate ancestry that ignores the possibility of common design.

Erika is currently pursuing her Master’s of Research in Primate Biology, Behavior and Conservation and is the creator of hundreds of punchy, entertaining YouTube videos. Her channel’s primary focus seems to be debunking Darwin-skeptics. Unfortunately, she does not seem to apply an equally critical eye to evolutionary theory.

Dr. Swamidass is also mentioned in the article.

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Also, not a terribly impressive piece, even by EN&V standards. I found this puzzling passage amusing:

To elaborate on her third critique, Erika argues that there is no genetic demarcation or separation that would mark a stopping place for comparison between species and higher orders of phyla. She is clearly ignoring reproductive barriers here.

Pass the vinaigrette.

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I looked at that post yesterday, when it went up at that ENV site.

Erika (Gutsick Gibbon) is right. The ID people need to develop their own research program if they want to persuade anyone. It’s easy to sit back and declare “common design could have done this”. But they have little to show in terms of actual evidence.

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Honestly, I thought it was a great article by Emily. Though we’ll disagree with the science at times, her post is acrimonious, and just an intro to what will be some more posts.

I’m curious to see how @GutsickGibbon responds.

Emily, if you ever read this, thanks for writing the post!

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A collection of PRATTs is a great article?? Acrimony is a good thing?? I know you bend over backwards to be friendly to creationists, but this is carrying things a bit far.

You are being charitable, surely. This is quite awful.

You don’t honestly think there is a legitimate scientific question raised here, do you? I would be shocked to hear you suggest any such thing.

Lordy. Preserve us. Pickle us, even.

So am I, because she is both scientifically competent and an excellent presenter. But you know very well that most of the people who post here could easily dismantle this nonsense. I’m sure she’ll do a better job than I could do, and I shall enjoy watching the puddle of left-over protoplasm run down the drain when she’s done. But I am also sure you could do a better job than I could do, which is why I am surprised that you feel it necessary to express a favorable opinion of this piece.

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I think a legitimate conversation could happen. :slight_smile:

Let her respond and let’s see.

Why? How? I’m mystified here.

Earlier this year, a popular evolution YouTuber, Gutsick Gibbon, or Erika, created a video response to my post here at Evolution News , “Do Statistics Prove Common Ancestry?”

Yes, they do.

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I hope that smiley face is intended to indicate that the preceding statement is a joke. Or that your definition of “conversation” in this context is “humiliating takedown of a clown.”

Seriously, now: I could imagine an interesting conversation where the fringey “Ah Ain’t Kin To No Monkey Dietary Counseling, LLC” clinician explains, on the basis of genetic testing, that as the patient ain’t kin to no monkey, the patient should go on a banana-free diet. But such a conversation will have all the scientific merit of the “if she weighs the same as a duck, she’s made of wood” conversation.

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Perhaps a legitimate but one-sided discussion where one side presents easily verifiable facts and the other falls on its facil bones.

If the seemingly “deceptive pattern” exists for a functional reason and has a “good design” explanation, then there really isn’t a “deceptive pattern.”

True, it’s just that no ID-creationist seems to be able to come up with what that functional reason is for the nested hierarchy in DNA sequences, or anatomy. They just assert it, never show it.

The “deceptive pattern” is imposed only by materialist lenses and a poor understanding of functional reasons for the similarities.

But I’d love to be told what the functional reason is with, you know, an actual predictive model with equal or better explanatory scope and power. Not just a mere assertion that “there are functional reasons”. A demonstration of it.

Thus, the assumption that ancestry is the only mechanism or best explanation for character similarity is not held by the ID proponent. Instead, ID proponents hold that a designer may produce similarity, much like different Gucci purses exhibit similarities. A more technical explanation of one ID model for separate ancestry can be found here.

“Here” links to Ewert’s dependency graph, which isn’t an actual model of separate ancestry and doesn’t deal with DNA sequences, anatomy, or the fossil record, physiology yadda yadda, and did not in fact show that any method of design consistently produces nesting hierarchical structure, etc.

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You will note that the author never mentions “nested hierarchy” at all, just “similarities”. It’s a good way to avoid noticing the pattern that needs explanation.

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And the pattern weighs differences as well as similarities (and identities, which have a greater weight in protein sequence hierarchies).

I’d like to point it that “Nutriplexity” is not an impressive name.

“The Gene Emergence Project Department of ProtoBioCybernetics & ProtoBioSemiotics, The Origin of Life Science Foundation, Incorporated.” is an impressive name.

Emily has much to learn.

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Perhaps she thought “Bio-Complexity” was a marvelous name, and wanted the same reputation for honesty and solid scientific integrity to be associated with her business. And that might be why she’s working out of the back end of Bremerton, Washington (“Gateway to Washington’s Meth Country!”).

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Emily could be reading your posts. From her new post:

In my previous post responding to YouTuber Gutsick Gibbon, aka Erika, I linked to Winston Ewert’s 2018 BIO-Complexity article, “The Dependency Graph of Life,” as a more technical explanation of how common design can yield a dataset with some tree-like structure. Winston’s central thesis is that the nested hierarchical pattern observed in subsets of genes is better accounted for by a dependency graph which reflects the fact that programmers re-use similar coding modules in different independent systems to fulfill similar functional needs. …

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She should read the parts where Ewert’s thing has been done to death, here and elsewhere.

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Emily Reeves had another post on this today:

Her “assumption-free science” seems to start by assuming intelligent design.

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